Chatting on Twitter, my friend @BarefootAndrew about the blog I wrote on French idioms, Andrew came up with the following stages he believed you pass through when learning a new language: - Spoken language is indecipherable gibberish, and the written word is Double Dutch.
- Words and phrases you know leap out at you when you hear them, but the gist of the sentence remains elusive.
- You can hold your own in basic conversation, but idioms and colloquialisms leave you blank of face.
- More or less fluent.
- You speak your adopted language so much, you're forgetting words from your native tongue.
Based on this I would say that I am mostly at stage 3. I am fine if the subject is one I know well and the person I am talking to enunciates clearly, but there are still many situations when I struggle:
- On the telephone
- With people who don't move their lips. I am amazed how much I concentrate on a person's mouth when conversing with them in French and which is why I find it so hard to cope with:
- Dubbed TV ... and anyway listening to the French voice they chose for George Clooney or Inspector Barnaby is just so ODD!! Did you know that even when watching a dubbed cartoon you can tell their cartoonish mouths are not fully in synch?
- In a crowded room - there are just too many sounds and I cannot concentrate
The boys are however somewhere between stages 4 and 5. They both converse fluently in French and as time goes by they are building up an ever increasing vocabulary including all those things that elude me - slang, idioms, abbreviations and swear words! In fairness I do know most of the time (I think) when they are uttering profanities but I do not know exactly what they are saying (nor do I want to) and I am sure there are swear words I am yet to learn. Interestingly for me, even though I have an extensive range of French swear words at my disposal, I find swearing in French just doesn't cut the mustard with me (nice idiom ... I wonder if there is a French equivalent? Couper la moutarde??!!). Nope if I have to swear it has to be in English!
Also for the boys, as they get holder and further up the school ladder, there are words they will learn in French that they do not know the English for. As to whether they will forget English words, that will no doubt depend on what path they take in life and whether it leads them deeper into France and French culture or back toward their native shores? In either case though they will have a HUGE advantage over many of their peers being bilingual, something I aspire to but suspect I will never truly reach.
Do you speak another language. Are you at stage 2 of just getting there or busy forgetting words from your mother tongue?
I so wish that I could speak another language fluently. I had a head start on French at my senior school as I attended a private school for a while. My teacher wasn't pleased that I didn't put it down as an option! Thank you for linking to PoCoLo :) x
ReplyDeleteI will never be bilingual ... but the boys will and it waill give them such as advantage in life!
DeleteYes! This is so true - I hover around three most of the time but there are some awesome moments of 2 depending on the stress of the situation! I read lips too and some French people can make sounds that others understand while hardly moving their mouths at all.
ReplyDeleteIt is hard work - I find wine helps when speaking in social gatherings. Your boys will have such a fantastic advantage!
ReplyDeleteI have learned and forgotten up to 6 languages. Most of them are so far in the back of my mind that they are at a 1.5. When I need them they move to a 2/3 and then up to a 4 as I spend more time in the language.
My Dad picked up so much Dutch that he dreams and counts in it. My (Dutch) mom became more fluent in English than some native speakers. We did not live in the UK until I was 8, however, so she spoke perfectly but without idiom until that time. As a consequence my English is much more formal than my sister who was 3 when my mom became idiomatically fluent.
Yup, this hits the nail on the head! (I had to add another idiom, haha). I'm with you in around the 3 range, and I also rely heavily on lips and single-speaker situations; though even now there are some days I find myself switching Dutch and English words as I go and forgetting the word I want to use in English. My son does much better, and thankfully the Dutch use many English swear words, so I'll know what's going on! =)
ReplyDeleteI think I've been stuck at 4.5 for about 10 years. I regularly forget English words, sometimes dream in French but still sometimes search for the right way to say something in French and would never describe myself as bilingual! I blame this on bringing up my boys bilingual with OPOL system (one parent one language)..brilliant for them (and honestly the only way I would have ever done it, so no hardship) but it means I always speak English at home even with french hubby who replies in French. My comprehension is beyond fluent and is certainly bilingual....but...I still find I'm a different person with my "French" hat on! I can't tell you how jealous I am of my truly bilingual kids. (I'm *slightly* less opinionated!!) #expatlifelinky
ReplyDeleteI'm actually glad they don't dub TV programs in the Netherlands. I remember watching an episode of Friends in French and being horrified!! lol I am somewhere between 4 and 5 I guess but still hate having to speak on the telephone as it is still more difficult than face to face - at least in my own mind. There are times when I cannot remember the word in English and the Dutch word slips out more naturally to compensate - not handy when you're a writer writing in English......
ReplyDeleteGreat post - thanks for linking up #ExpatLifeLinky